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DUCATI ECU and BBS Tuning (Racing EVO) for aftermarket exhaust

A

A016738

Member
craig bush said:
Have you heard anything about SLR Tuning?
Click to expand...
I've got a '20 PV4 Base with a "PHL" stage 2 decatted, cored out stock exhaust, with it's butterfly valve neutered, the racier version of the Sprint filter, running on generally 93 octane pump gas.

I originally bought a Bren tune and he first tune they sent had a big hole at 5-7k...like the one it had bone stock as I rode it home day one new...but worse. They immediately sent me a new tune that totally fixed the hole but always seemed like it was running a little rich. Smelled rich, surged a low throttle in 3rd gear below 4k RPM (I know...shouldn't really be going there anyway but ...) and I started to wonder if this tune had cured the hole but richened it up throughout and might have been giving away power throughout. Seemed like it pulled pretty hard everywhere but it's hard to tell via the butt dyno as I don't have another PV4 to hop on to compare to. I had no complaints but wondered if I was leaving something on the table.

So after much internal debate and as an experiment, I broke down and bought the SLR handheld and loaded that one up yesterday. After a single short ride this AM it feels way better...surging is gone, I smell less like exhaust coming off the bike, and it pulls real hard everywhere. Also oddly enough has a slightly different exhaust note...not louder, but tonally a little different. So far I'm very happy with it but it's 45 and overcast today so I'm waiting for nicer day to wring it's neck and really explore it.

I'm also hoping to book some dyno time locally to run the Bren and SLR tunes back to back with AFRs to see empirically how they differ. There's been a raging debate on "the other ducati board" over the Bren vs other tuners and this would go a long way to shed light on that.

Based on a canned tune and a butt dyno, the SLR tune is definitely better on my machine.

But I will also say it's tough to tune a bike remotely based just on a configuration without data and so both Bren and SLR are kind of throwing darts here. Especially since I have an exhaust they've likely never tuned against. According to Phil (the fabricator), it's close to an Akra or Arrow slip on in terms of flow, but even that's just a best guess.

Both shops have been very responsive and customer service has been excellent all around. Both have said they would adjust maps and resend as necessary but again, without data to drive that process it can't possibly be precise.

Links to both products

brentuningmoto.com

20-22 Ducati V4 / V4S / V4 SP Handheld Diagnostic Tool (Stage 1)

Stage 1 with handheld for the Ducati V4 / S/ V4SP. Remove your factory ECU restrictions with BT Moto .
brentuningmoto.com

slrtuning.com

2015-2021 Ducati V2/V4/V4S/V4R /1199/1299 SLR Handheld Programmer

ATTN: Watch our SLR Handheld Video for your Ducati Ecu flash availability! If you see your motorcycle model on the SLR Handheld scroll down screen, then we can flash it... SLR Tuning offers you a Stag1 Ecu Flash for your Ducati V4/V4S/V4R motorcycle. Our tuning transforms the performance and...
slrtuning.com slrtuning.com


-John
 
craig bush

craig bush

Well-known member
Excellent feedback John. (y)

I appreciate your perspective as clearly you have some experience and insight regarding these issues, and you appreciate the difference between (and relative value of) empirical vs anecdotal data.

I’m following the other thread as well and look forward to your updates.

I am considering an exhaust for my 18 base (talked to Phil), and have postponed only because of the limited tuning options. I’d go Woolich if it was available. Of the “canned” tunes in the market, SLR seems to have the most consistently positive endorsements, but my builder derides all of the available flash tunes as “fat maps” that just indiscriminately throw fuel at the motor without actually tuning it.
 
G

ggok

Active member
If you think you can unlock the true power of Panigale V4 by simply tweaking the ENGINE CONTROL UNIT (ECU), you're out of date.
V4 machines have more ECUs than just ENGINE CONTROL UNIT. If you can't control the torque or adjust the electronic gearbox, it's an acorn comparison. It is the difference between fuel and ignition adjustment skill of Dinomachine operator.
Some people call ECU flashes, which don't adjust the motorcycle with a real car, dung, but they don't know anything about it. The Panigale V4 is smart and very smart.:cool:
 
A

A016738

Member
I’m sure all the above is true...but I’m not competing with this bike against teams running custom Motec electronics packages...in fact, I’m not competing at all with my bike. Just looking for something that can make the most out of the modest modifications I have made and can improve on the ridability over the stock tuning....which either of these products can do.

In capable hands they can both produce HP gains and improved torque and HP curves over a bone stock machine.

Having said that, again I agree with what you’ve said...and for some on this forum, this level of tune isn’t enough...but for largely a street queen with an occasional track day sprinkled in they can do an adequate job.
 
The Avidmoto

The Avidmoto

New member
I would be very interested in your SLR vs. Brentuning flashes. I have Brentuning's flash but have been seeing a lot of negativity around them and one of their alleged marketing men. It's got me wondering. I check in with RapidBike every now and again but there is still no eta.
 
BMW Alpina

BMW Alpina

FOUNDING Member & Administrator
Staff member
G

ggok

Active member
My post is not for a specific individual, but it may contain some irony directed at other external forums 😜.

Third-party ECU flash tools are useful for those who are concerned with negative areas in normal conditions and for those who want to improve drivability.
The current tools on the market allow only a limited number of parameter changes, so it will be a good bridge to the next generation tools and a good base for extensive tuning.

Personally, I expect Woolich to develop software that can also modify BBS parameters.
About two years ago, when they announced the start of V4 machine development, I registered my email address on their site.
I will be contacted when the V4 software is available, but as of today I have not received any.
Also, according to rumors on the Internet and SNS, it will be released this spring, and on the other hand, it has abandoned development.

Considering that the software for the later SBK BIKE has been released compared to the Panigale V4, there are many difficult issues and problems in the development of V4 machines.

Even though it is a DUCATI formula, it is the same as a third-party flash tool. Sometimes they provide us with good firmware and mapping updates.
 
G

ggok

Active member
BMW Alpina said:
Hi Ggok,
Do you know whether this DTC EVO3 software can work for my bike that came with DTC EVO2 standard (non slick) as 2020 model?
Thanks
Click to expand...
MY 21 Panigale V4 has 4 riding modes.
The old Street, Sport, and Race modes, Race is extended to RaceA and RaceB.
It was used in Superlegera V4 and Panigale V4 SP.
RaceA remains the same, but RaceB removes the 1 -3 speed torque limit, allowing a 100% throttle butterfly opening.
This torque limit release does not allow parameter editing. And it is only allocated to RaceB.

Ducati DTC EVO3 SLICK PAN V4 MY 21 Partno.: 96580271 AA

This is a product in which the DTC program of BBS is changed to the parameters for racing only slick tires, and DASH (RACE, RACE EVO) and ECU (Stock, Akrapovic) are also changed accordingly.
It 21's completely different from the EVO3 model, which is legal on the road.

I am not sure if it can only be applied to MY 21 model or it can be applied to past models that have already been released
 
G

ggok

Active member
DUCATI Performance DTC DQS EVO2 96580201 A

Buyers can choose to map to BBS for slick or grooved tires.
However, it seems that the mapping to the ECU automatically determines the data to be written by the diagnostic machine based on the current ECU data and the mapping name.
I thought the buyer could also choose the ECU data, but that was a mistake.
The upgrade to the Performance EVO2 assumes that the ECU has already been flushed with DUCATI ’ s original stock-exhaust, slip-akrapovic, and full-akrapovic mappings.
In the case of stock-exhaust, nothing is displayed in DASH. In the case of slip-akrapovic, racing is displayed. In the case of full-akrapovic, racing evo is displayed.
The mode display is RACE EVO, SPORT EVO, STREET EVO for all cars.

Therefore, if the ECU is not flushed in the DUCATI formula, it may be possible to display in Racing or Racing EVO and DASH by changing to the ECU mapping (racing･racing pro) corresponding to the formula using a third party flash tool and introducing EVO2 or EVO3 in that state. It is a DUCATI official Racing ECU map.

This is my thought, or just a delusion.


Please refer to my past posts regarding the mapping name, etc.

DUCATI ECU and BBS Tuning (Racing EVO) for aftermarket exhaust

To make changes to the BBS and ECU, you will need a "Kvaser Leaf Light HS v2", a CAN-Converter to connect to your PC. You will also need a cable to connect the vehicle to the Kvaser. https://www.kvaser.com/product/kvaser-leaf-light-hs-v2-obdii/...
ducatimodified.com ducatimodified.com

DUCATI ECU and BBS Tuning (Racing EVO) for aftermarket exhaust

To make changes to the BBS and ECU, you will need a "Kvaser Leaf Light HS v2", a CAN-Converter to connect to your PC. You will also need a cable to connect the vehicle to the Kvaser. https://www.kvaser.com/product/kvaser-leaf-light-hs-v2-obdii/...
ducatimodified.com ducatimodified.com
 
BMW Alpina

BMW Alpina

FOUNDING Member & Administrator
Staff member
The Avidmoto said:
I must say a cordial discussion over a controversial topic without personal digs and cursing is quite nice.
Click to expand...
A016738 said:
Exactly
Click to expand...
Thanks @The Avidmoto and @A016738 ,
That was the reason that spark the Genesis of this forum in the first place, and it become basically The Constitution of this forum as written in the "About this Forum", screenshot below :)
1618437107713.png

We currently have 6 moderators, each with full moderating powers guarding this Constitution, 3 in the Northern Hemisphere (USA) and 3 in the Southern Hemisphere (literally since they are located in Australia) ;), so like the British Empire long time ago, The Sun Never Sets at DUCATImodified.com 😁

Back to topic,
From their website, looks like both SLR and BrenTuning like most other tuning firm for Panigale V4 use the same tuning handheld hardware sourced from Dimsport, website link here: Race

I am guessing, also from what @ggok mention above, there were just too many variations of Panigale V4 out there. Some have the older ECU and BBS and DTC system? Some have combination of newer software but older hardware and it could be that the tuning that BrentTuning or SLR provide for a Panigale V4 was developed from a bike that was available at their facility.
However, the bike that the end user (customer) have might have slight differences in either hardware or software combination that make the tune not perfectly suitable.
Yes, in the end, the best tuning need to be done with the bike on the dyno and tune per that specific bike only.

Well, hopefully more discussion regarding tuning can be had in this thread so we all can understand better and learn from other experience (good or bad).
Of course it will be much easier to understand the discussion when there is no crazy forum member (and I really mean "Crazy" in real literally crazy/mental problem) allowed. 😌
 
M

MaverickiB

Well-known member
ggok said:
My post is not for a specific individual, but it may contain some irony directed at other external forums 😜.

Third-party ECU flash tools are useful for those who are concerned with negative areas in normal conditions and for those who want to improve drivability.
The current tools on the market allow only a limited number of parameter changes, so it will be a good bridge to the next generation tools and a good base for extensive tuning.

Personally, I expect Woolich to develop software that can also modify BBS parameters.
About two years ago, when they announced the start of V4 machine development, I registered my email address on their site.
I will be contacted when the V4 software is available, but as of today I have not received any.
Also, according to rumors on the Internet and SNS, it will be released this spring, and on the other hand, it has abandoned development.

Considering that the software for the later SBK BIKE has been released compared to the Panigale V4, there are many difficult issues and problems in the development of V4 machines.

Even though it is a DUCATI formula, it is the same as a third-party flash tool. Sometimes they provide us with good firmware and mapping updates.
Click to expand...
I've been in contact with Motorsport Exotica (a dealership out of the LA-area with a racing team) recently, any they have informed me there are 3 different ECU flash/tuning options on the verge of being released sometime in the next few months. So, even if the rumors are true that Woolich dropped development, it seems there are a couple others working on it actively.
 
G

ggok

Active member
moto-d racing previously sold a limited edition of the spark full exhaust system for WSBK.

POWER GATE 3 terminal was also included.
It accesses the ECU and BBS and is responsible for reprogramming the data adjusted for the exhaust system.

POWER GATE 3 is also used by germany rexxer, Italy rexxer, and openflash Performance.

Anyone, please hack the DUCATI CAN PID SID as soon as possible :cool:
キャプチャ.PNG

www.motodracing.com

The Spark Full Titanium Racing Exhaust w/ UpMap for the WSBK Ducati Panigale V4 S/R

The most expensive and powerful titanium exhaust for the Ducati Panigale V4R from Spark, direct from Eugene Laverty's World Superbike is a masterpiece.
www.motodracing.com www.motodracing.com
 
Last edited:
G

ggok

Active member
Apuca said:
Hi, I’m about to purchase some parts from this distributor. Are they reputable
Click to expand...
Hi,
I don't know the reputation of this distributor because I just used it for part number search and price research. I'm sorry.
 
HKMP7

HKMP7

First 9 & Moderator
Staff member
Apuca said:
Hi, I’m about to purchase some parts from this distributor. Are they reputable
Click to expand...
I’ve bought stuff from them they carry oem bmw motorcycle parts pretty cheap.
I haven’t had any issues.
 
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