R cams in an S, tuning options

[Aharp]

Hi all,
Thanks for letting me in the house

Title says it all. I have a 19 V4S that I have wondered about putting the R top end on. Tuning adjustability would obviously need to be top level which is maybe why I have not found anyone who has done this. I have a dyno with extensive tuning and engine building experience but that stops when it comes to how the engine/ECU interact with things like DSC, DWC, DTC, etc.

I consulted with Mr Deussen who advised against attempting this operation unless I took the bike to Germany. That is prohibitive for me since I am in the states. But it only made me wonder about the electronics more and increasing power even more.

Before I get responses like, "well you cant use any more of that power unless your last name is Marquez or Bautista"- yeah, I know and I get it. And none of the rest of us can use it to its fullest potential either lol. But we do it because we can.

So has anyone seen an S or base 1103 with an R top end? What are the limitations regarding power output? I assume at some point the torque modeling is exceeded and it will intervene by limiting throttle, etc. Without the $20k motec setup, what are the tuners that give the most accessibility?

Thanks for any answers. Should at least make for an interesting discussion?

 

[BMW Alpina]

Hi all,
Thanks for letting me in the house

Title says it all. I have a 19 V4S that I have wondered about putting the R top end on. Tuning adjustability would obviously need to be top level which is maybe why I have not found anyone who has done this. I have a dyno with extensive tuning and engine building experience but that stops when it comes to how the engine/ECU interact with things like DSC, DWC, DTC, etc.

I consulted with Mr Deussen who advised against attempting this operation unless I took the bike to Germany. That is prohibitive for me since I am in the states. But it only made me wonder about the electronics more and increasing power even more.

Before I get responses like, "well you cant use any more of that power unless your last name is Marquez or Bautista"- yeah, I know and I get it. And none of the rest of us can use it to its fullest potential either lol. But we do it because we can.

So has anyone seen an S or base 1103 with an R top end? What are the limitations regarding power output? I assume at some point the torque modeling is exceeded and it will intervene by limiting throttle, etc. Without the $20k motec setup, what are the tuners that give the most accessibility?

Thanks for any answers. Should at least make for an interesting discussion?

Hi @Aharp , this is a spectacular project,
However, isn't the V4R has 998cc displacement? What kind of modification that you plan to do (mechanically) to make the V4R top end fit the 1103cc Panigale V4S?

 

[Aharp]

Hi @Aharp , this is a spectacular project,
However, isn't the V4R has 998cc displacement? What kind of modification that you plan to do (mechanically) to make the V4R top end fit the 1103cc Panigale V4S?

Yes, different displacement. However in my research the only differences I can find besides the displacement is the cams and throttle bodies. The valve sizes are the same between the S and R heads, bore size is the same which would lead me to believe the piston to valve side clearances are likely still there but I do not know about the valve pocket depth in the pistons.

The R cam specs have quite a bit more lift on the intake side (exhaust seems to be the same between S and R) and the duration is a little more although I cannot see it being a detriment to the S rpm range.

I do not know if the head castings differ between the S and R but I doubt it if the valve sizes are the same.

The R throttle bodies are bigger than the S.

So only the cams and throttle bodies to be used essentially.

The Woolich tuner claims to be able to modify the torque modeling tables and I would like to get their tuner anyway whether or not I choose to pursue this project. I have a lot of other irons in the fire